Monday, November 09, 2009

No Kids? I boycott your Wedding

Anywhere, USA: Dear Prudie,

A mother wrote in to Dear Prudie on the subject of children at weddings.  Here is the question and her response:
I am having some trouble with my son, "Charlie". This past spring, he got married. He and his bride decided to exclude my other son's children, two boys aged 6 and 9, from their wedding festivities. We are a close-knit family, and this was very disappointing to his nephews. I tried to convince him that his actions were hurtful, but he would not listen. Things were said in anger, and as a result, I and my family chose not to attend the wedding if everyone would not be invited.

Since then, he has cut off all communication with us, he won't take or return our calls, and he even "un-friended" his brother on Facebook. My grandchildren's birthdays came and went, and he didn't bother to send a card or even call them to wish them happy birthday.

Prudie, this is not how I raised my son to behave, and it's the kids who are suffering most from this family feud. My heart breaks for them. With the holidays approaching, they're sure to ask why Uncle Charlie hasn't come. They must feel as though he doesn't love them. How do I encourage him to make amends? I just want our family to be whole again.
-Miserable Matriarch

Emily Yoffe: You say you didn't raise your son to escalate small disagreements into major breaches, but, Mom, you led the rest of the family into a boycott of your son's wedding ceremony! I'd say he's absorbed the upbringing you gave him very well. Your son and his wife didn't want children at the wedding. That is a perfectly reasonable decision to make, even if two of the children excluded were his nephews. It may have annoyed everyone, but what the people with children do is hire a babysitter, keep their complaints to themselves, and enjoy child-free afternoon.

You can try the politician's passive "mistakes were made" locution, but you and the others who didn't go made a whopper of a mistake. Own up. Write a sincere letter of apology saying you made bad decision of your life by not going to the wedding, and the estrangement is tearing everyone apart. Ask their forgiveness and invite the newlyweds out for a peace dinner. Your other son should send his own letter if he would like to repair relations. Do it now -- maybe this Thanksgiving you can all share a family meal.
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47 comments:

Phoena said...

This woman is delusional!

"My grandchildren's birthdays came and went, and he didn't bother to send a card or even call them to wish them happy birthday. ...My heart breaks for them. With the holidays approaching, they're sure to ask why Uncle Charlie hasn't come. They must feel as though he doesn't love them.... ...it's the kids who are suffering most from this family feud."

The kids are not bawling their eyes out and slitting their wrists because an uncle didn't call them on their birthday! Come on! The kids probably didn't even notice! Kids might be upset if a parent didn't call them, but they don't care about what the hell their uncle is doing!! Most kids only care about their aunts and uncles if they have kids the same age, because then they are excited to see their cousins. Doesn't sound like that's the case here.

Also, if the kids were SOOOOOO close to Uncle Charlie that they cry every night he's not around, I'm sure he'd have made an exception for them at the wedding.

With a drama queen mother like this, no wonder the guy isn't speaking to the family!

Anonymous said...

Finally! An advice columnist who makes sense.

Sun Runner said...

Wow...overreact much? So the couple decided to have a kidfree wedding as as a result this woman (I almost wrote something else but decided not to) convinced her ENTIRE FAMILY to boycott the wedding? OK, now I'll say it: WHAT A BITCH!

I would LOVE to hear the son's side of THIS one!

Maggie said...

Why do people forget that the wedding day is about the COUPLE GETTING MARRIED, not about the people getting invited? Its their wedding, so if they want to plan a kid-free celebration, that's within their rights. I didn't have alcohol at my wedding, but it didn't keep the drinkers away. They stashed their hooch and joined the festivities.

Anonymous said...

Until you have children and they have been excluded, you could never understand the devastation. My brother has excluded his godson and the only nephew from his wedding without so much as a reason. Just a cold, "no kids" claim. My four year old son who adores his uncle is upset and cannot understand why his whole family gets to go and he cannot. "Did I make him mad at me?" is the question.
Again, without children, you can't understand!

Sean said...

"Until you have children and they have been excluded, you could never understand the devastation. My brother has excluded his godson and the only nephew from his wedding without so much as a reason."

Give. Me. A. Break. Please.

How could that possibly be devastating to anyone? When I was growing up I was excluded from any number of things my parents wanted to do just with adults. Ever heard of date night?

kelly said...

So, why can't the parents of these kids tell them the reason their Uncle isn't around anymore is because they're mad at him? Go ahead and tell the kids you're all punishing Uncle for making a decision you didn't agree with. Forever. And that you're okay with doing it at their expense.

Maybe it's good none of you went to the wedding, if it was requested that no children attend.

Maegan said...

I have kids...who have not been included in an invite. If the invite is EVER not clear, I ASK. I have no problem leaving my children at home. For all I know the host/ess plans to unleash a string of profanities or dance naked...or do some other activity that wouldn't be appropriate for a child. OR they just simply don't want to worry that a child might start to cry in the middle of something important...or break something expensive. I have a friend (not childfree, she has 1 girl) who, at her wedding, had the flower girl & ring bearer as the only children allowed in the service. When their roles were over...they were to be whisked away to a caretaker. The caretaker was on-site (the bride thought this was a fair compromise since she still wanted the parents to attend, rather than have to drive the children to a babysitter), but the children were not permitted to be at the reception. Her sister-in-law had given birth to a new baby just 10 days before the wedding. Her brother commented that if the baby couldn't come, then neither could his wife. The bride said, "I guess she'll have to watch the video!" I get it. I'm okay with it. If my kids are specifically excluded (not just b/c I don't want to bring them, but b/c the host/ess says NO KIDS) I don't mention it to them. "Mommy, where are you and Daddy going?" Out! Have fun with grandma tonight! Even if I just think it will be a better/easier time without my child, I don't tell them, "Mommy is leaving you behind, but I'm going to go play with your most favorite auntie!!" I say, "Mommy is leaving you to have fun with Grandma [or sitter]. Please be very good while I'm gone!"

gwdzee said...

Let's get this straight. Unless this is your wedding or you are paying for another's wedding, you have no say in what goes. Whether 'alcohol will be served' or 'no kids'.

I suspect the reason the kids get upset (if they really do) is because the 'parents', instead of being adults about this, choose to throw tantrums and made sure the kids know what's going on. They made damn sure the kids knew they were not invited. Just what, pray tell, does that accomplish? Pretty damn sick thing to do.

Not to mention the fact that it's 'no kids' period. Unless otherwise indicated, it isn't just one couple's kid being excluded. Again, the parents could just tell the kids, 'no kids are going to be there'. No big deal. The kid will probably think, 'well, it'll be boring' and not be interested in going. I knew that's what I thought back then.

So spare us this whiny 'you don't have kids, you don't understand' crap.

I feel sorry for the kids, having these so-called adults for parents.

Anonymous said...

Anonymous, your brother doesn't have to give a reason. It's HIS wedding, remember? And maybe this would've been a good time to explain that some things are for kids and some things are for adults. But then again, you probably tote your tot everywhere.

And you need to get rid of the "you won't understand if you're not a parent" trope. Believe it or not, most of us understand common courtesy and etiquette. It has nothing to do with being a parent -- obviously since you are objecting to not being allowed to bring someone to a wedding who was specifically NOT invited.

GothCeltGirl said...

Maegan, you're spot on. Telling the kids what's going on is just petty and laying the responsibility on them and it's not their burden. Very good advice, simply not telling them specifics.

She probably didn't even think it was a bad decision at the time when she told them that Uncle Charlie didn't want them there. But then again...

Anonymous said...

While I am in agreeance with "the bride has rights" etc, I have recently been invited to a "Child Free Zone" wedding. I am a long-term friend of the groom. This wedding is a location wedding - at least 2 hours away from all attending. There are 3 couples with very young children (ours is the eldest - he will be 18mths). This puts us in a very awkward position. We have no family nearby, and have never left our son for more than an hour or so with friends. As the wedding is so far away, we would either have to leave him with friends at home for an entire day and night, or find a stranger to mind him at the location - again for all afternoon/night. The Best Man will have a 4 mth old, and the Sister of the Groom a 13 mth old and a 1 mth old. Are all these people meant to arrange for strangers to mind their infants. All of the babies are breastfed - the brand-newies every 2 hours or so. The logistics are impossible. Babysitters are for young children - 3 and upwards, not for brand new infants. As a result, I have to make a choice - attend the wedding of my friend, and place my baby with a stranger for 10 hours, or to not attend. It is a difficult position to be in, but ultimately I choose - the best option for my son. This is what parents do. I want to respect the bride's choices, but secretley I feel that she is not considering her guests needs either. I don't understand how someone can be a loving friend, and then get to their wedding day, and pull out all stops to not consider the needs of others. The line "parents can have a good night without their kids", is usually used by childless people. Brides, please allow your friends with VERY young (under 2) children to make this choice for themselves, as it causes much anguish to those who want the very best for you in your celebration, but also have responsibilities to their children.

Childfree Vegan said...

If you wouldn't trust your good friend to recommend a sitter, it sounds like you have issues much bigger than attending her wedding.

Anonymous said...

Oh please! Have you ever babysat an infant?! They sleep they cry they poop. You feed them. Infants are way easier than the terrible twos. The fact of the matter is that it inconveniences you to have to go and find a babysitter. And as a mother of a child under two you do have a choice to find a babysitter or stay at home with baby. You do not however have the right to be passive aggressive with the fact that the bride chose to have her wedding her way.

Anonymous said...

I am getting married in the next few months. A few of the guests have young children. We are having a child free wedding ceremony and dinner because we do not want our vows yelled over a screaming child. This includes my nephew, whom I am quite fond of. In order to offend the fewest people possible (because let's face it some parent will always be offended that their little miracle isn't being included) we have done the following; we are providing the services of one teenage babysitter along with one professional childcare provider in a hotel room (2 floors at maximum from where the parents will be), we are providing games and pizza as well as movies. Children are welcome during the dance part of the reception.

My god, not only is the woman in the original article overly dramatic, there are a few posters who I think need a nap.

Laura said...

Boycotting the wedding because the couple requested no children is the MEANEST thing a parent can do!!! SHAME ON THIS MOTHER!!!! NEWS FLASH!! It's not the family's decision who to invite. It's about the couple. If your solution to problems is to get the entire family to gang up and boycott a wedding, you'll NEVER have peaceful family. Lead by example "Mom".

Anonymous said...

My brother is getting married in Nov. and will not allow my one year old son, his Godson to attend his wedding. They live 3,000 miles away and there is no one to "babysit" my son which leaves us in an uncomfortable situation. Our resolution is that my husband will not attend the wedding and stay in the hotel with my son. This has caused many hurt feelings that will last long after the wedding is over. I understand that their wedding day is all about them but the fact that they do not want my son and husband involved in their special day is extremely upsetting.

Childfree Vegan said...

Have you asked your brother for help? It seems like such a little thing for him to ask around and find a reputable babysitter for the evening. Maybe some of the other wedding guests with kids can organize a playgroup - so much more fun for your kids than a boring wedding!

Responsible Mother said...

I agree that Grandma's reaction was inappropriate, she should have gone to the wedding, the kids would have been fine.
Younger kids are a different story.
My kids are grown and I agree that it often isn't possible for parents of small children to leave them with a sitter. Many babies have separation anxiety that starts at 4 to 6 months. They don't want to be held by anyone who is unfamiliar. I don't care how reputable the sitter is, you don't leave your very young child with an unknown person for hours if you know your baby is going to be hysterical. The babies don't do it for attention, they often don't calm down for hours after the parents return and it isn't bad parenting that makes them do it.

It is amazing that so many people who know so little about young children are having a discussion about this. My kids were very difficult toddlers, one with autism, and we didn't go places where they would cause a problem. This meant very little travel, few meals out with them. This caused problems with family who often wanted to get together for meals at restaurants, it wasn't any fun for us and they wanted to see the kids. Expecting a 2-3-4-5 year old to be entertained at a meal for an hour is a mistake and unfortunately there isn't any legal way to "take out their batteries" so they'll sleep. They were fine once they turned 9 or 10 and could entertain themselves.

Anonymous said...

When my younger sister and I were growing up, our parents did not bring us to weddings and other similar events. When we were babies, there were times when my parents chose to not attend an event because they felt that bringing babies/toddlers to weddings, etc. was not appropriate, and they didn't want to leave us with babysitters. They sent a card/gift to the couple; nobody was offended in the slightest because people understood that it was not necessary to have children at every freaking event. My sister and I were not traumatized over any of it either; we were just excited because we were going to spend time with Grandma or whoever the babysitter was going to be. It was fun.

I have a theory. I think that people just get themselves wound up over stupid stuff like this just to get attention. People just need to chill out, spend a few bucks and get a babysitter. The bride and groom and their families are spending a fortune on a one-day event... help them to make it a wonderful, memorable day and quit being selfish.

Anonymous said...

@The anonymous who is mad about a child-free wedding and whose child is 18 months....

Since when are babysitters only for 3+? I had a full-time babysitter from before age 2 to age 12. My friends child is 13 months right now and he has repeatedly had babysitters because his parents have lives. And he is the most chill, well-behaved baby I've ever seen. He USED to cry when they left him, now he just fakes it and as soon as they're gone, he's totally fine.

And for 10 hours??That's it, seriously?? Also, 2 hours is NOT a 'location' wedding. It's some people's commute to work every morning for goodness sake.

The bride and groom have no responsibility to think about the guest's needs, its a party to celebrate their marriage and they invited you because they wanted you to be there. If you can't (breastfeeding IS a really good reason, though, for sure!)just don't go. You don't have to. And if you can't, and they get mad,then that's their problem.

Oh, and you really think NO parents can have a good time without their kids?! Maybe YOU have seperation anxiety.

Liz @ MaybeBabyMaybeNot said...

My husband and I actually offered to pay for a hotel room and babysitter to keep all the kids at bay during our reception. No dice. Apparently we needed to be a little more direct. *Sigh*

Anonymous said...
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Anonymous said...

I don't think the whole family should have boycott! I think the people that could have made it should have come! I agree that it is the bride and grooms day! It's easy to say no kids when you don’t have any kids! But mind you it is very hard to find a babysitter. I had the babysitter cancel on me the day before the wedding!!! I really wanted to go to the wedding but I could not go because she said no kids! If my child is acting in appropriate I can kindly step out during the wedding, but my child might be fine! Why judge me and my children!!! We want this day to be a special day for you as well and we want to be apart of it!!! It does not cost additional money just to come to the wedding and not the reception!

Anonymous said...

I think that you are an absolute monster for boycotting your son's wedding. Plenty of people do not have children at weddings anymore. You were the one in the wrong, and you made a mistake you will spend your life regretting. Your son did no wrong. All the blame should be placed on you and your family members who refused to attend. I would consider sending him a very long apology letter. Swallow your pride and get your son back.

Anonymous said...

I sympathise completely. I have a similar predicament with a family wedding. Again a location wedding over two hours away. We have been invited but our children excluded. I disagree with the person who says if you can't trust friends to make a sitter recommendation there's a wider problem. I for one am very careful about who I leave my children with. We don't feel able to attend the wedding as we would need to leave the children for up to 12 hours!

Yes ok it is their special day but surely part of that is celebrating it with people who care about you. Excluding the children makes it very difficult for parents to attend.

Anonymous said...

Wait... You're blaming your brother for *your* mutual parental decision to leave your husband behind with bubs?

Get a babysitter *there* for a couple of hours. A creche will do.

Or just not go yourself as you seem to be displaying some resentment towards your brother for not making his special day catered to your little family.

Share with him your entitled post here, guaranteed you'll never have to worry about travel issues again.

Anonymous said...

No, we understand perfectly. It's just not our legal obligation to give a shit. That falls in the "yp" column as opposed to the "mp."

Anonymous said...

Sadly, the world doesn't revolve around you or your kid. A wedding is all about the couple getting married, If they don't want screaming kids on their special day. Being a breeder doesn't give you entitlements.

hil said...

I have a kid. Part of raising a kid is teaching them about what is appropriate. If a wedding is child free you teach that child to understand this is an adult only affair, but they can participate by making a nice card and viewing photos and videos later. Set boundaries with your children, don't let them dominate you with selfish behavior! Disappointment is a part of life every child must learn to handle.

Anonymous said...

Actually it is about personal choice she chose to not want children at her wedding. You chose to have a child. You chose not to want anyone else looking after said child. And you can choose to not attend If you cannot find proper arraignments.

Anonymous said...

A MOTHER refuses to attends a sons wedding and then doesn't understand why her son will have nothing to do with her?? Hope that she didn't pass along her "intellect."

And NO! Little kids are not "devastated" at not attending what to them is a boring ceremony. Parents may get their foundation garments twisted, but small fry don't even know unless said parents make it a Greek tragedy.

How do I know? Traditional Irish Catholic family here. Last generation had families of 9 & 10 kids, this one topped at 5 but still LOTS of kids and ALL receptions (for 3 generations at least)are childfree. Once a kid is "bombproof" at Sunday mass (usually age 7 or 8) they may attend weddings but no receptions until you hit 18 and you sit at a "kid's table" until you are 21. (Alcohol is served and this makes things easier for both servers and watching parents).
Sometimes heavily pregnant/just gave birth women don't come but Dad does. Sometimes Mom shows up on her own while Dad stays home with 2 or 3 sproggen under the age of 5. Sometimes both parents give a wedding a miss. No one has suffered devastation yet, no kids in post-wedding therapy. Living proof that people can have & love kids yet still remain adults themselves.

Anonymous said...

In regards to the comments that have the phrase, "I know it's the couple's special day, but..." I'm going to stop you right there. It is, as you said, the couple's special day. Your needs come second. If I'm invited to a wedding that's too far to drive, and I can't afford to go, I send a gift and extend my regrets. If I can't get off of work, same thing. If you can't make it to a childfree wedding because you can't make accommodations, simply graciously decline, and ask to see pictures afterward. If you don't feel inclined to send a gift to a wedding you couldn't attend, send a card.

What this woman did - not just refusing to attend a wedding, but encouraging the rest of her son's family to do the same - was horrible. In doing this, she tarnished what should have been one of the happiest, most meaningful days of his life. She has also created strain between herself and her daughter-in-law. It may be easier for a son to forgive his mother if she apologizes, but the DIL doesn't have that family tie to smooth things over. I also can't help but notice the way she phrased the argument - "Things were said in anger." I have to wonder how many of those "things" were said by her. And then to have the gall to insist that he be the one to apologize, rather than a mutual apology being issued, is downright pigheaded.

Anonymous said...

It is still the bride and groom's choice.

If I ever get married, it will be a childfree wedding. No kids, no babies. Just adults.
It's nothing against the kids, I just prefer an adult setting. I don't want to have to have kid food or accommodate children by monitering my language or actions.

So to each their own. I may not understand the parent's side, but that isn't the side that matters anyway, it's the bride and grooms side.

Jamie said...

Believe me, they'd be more upset with you for your kid disrupting the ceremony than they'd be mad you didn't come. I guarantee this is what most couples are afraid of. I'd seen so many disruptions which were supposed to be special moments that I decided to not have that chance at my wedding. One woman even let her child play a handheld game during the vows, which was beeping!! Everyone kept turning around and giving her the evil eye but she did not care! I'm sure there were people that didn't come to my wedding because we didn't invite kids, but whatever! At least I got to zone in on my husbands eyes as we exchanged vows instead of having my attention momentarily grabbed by an inappropriate sound from the audience. What people don't seem to get is that it's not that we don't like your kids or want them around us, I love kids! But I can see kids any time I want, I only get married once, and having no disruptions was incredibly important to me.

Anonymous said...

Just because you would take your kids out for being inappropriate, doesn't mean everyone else would. Plus, even if you're quick about taking them out, your kid is still going to be screaming during a wedding, and it will be forever on their tapes. Get over yourself, they aren't judging you, they just don't want to listen to your kids scream on THEIR day and money isn't the issue.

Anonymous said...

It seems that you don't relay understand that their wedding day is all about them.

Anonymous said...

If you protest how someone else is having their wedding, you are saying "It is more important that my vision of your wedding comes true instead of your vision of your wedding."

It is their wedding. If they want to do it with the guests standing on their heads, that's their prerogative. If you can't stand on your head, send a nice card saying "I'm sorry, but I won't be able to make it. Hope it's everything you dreamed of!"

Same goes for the presence of children.

You don't get to dictate someone else's wedding. Not even if you're a mother of a participant. It's not your day.

Anonymous said...

I see some posters have said that it's harder for people with very young children to find a babysitter because their children are so finicky, and I won't debate that with you, as I don't spend lots of time around infants. However, the logical response to this is the absolute opposite of the suggestions. If someone doesn't want children around because they will be finicky, WHY would they make an exception for the most finicky of the bunch? It's just selfish to presume that people should be completely ok with the possibility of your infant screaming over the entirety of their probably-expensive wedding video because you want the situation to be easier on you. $5 says the parents who want exceptions made for their anxious infants are the same parents who will NOT take the infants out of the ceremony if they start to cry.

Anonymous said...

Its a week before my wedding and it seems even though I have send our invitation months in advance people now ask if they can bring their kids with......I think people just don't want to go anywhere without their children, today I feel like I have wasted so much money on a wedding that is nothing but a frustration, because I am again the one that needs to bend to other people's needs like always.........wish I have just eloped!!!!

Anonymous said...

Wow, you are the classic "helicoptor mom", always hovering and thinking nobody is qualified to watch your baby but you. And I feel sorry for your husband, as i'm sure he is willing to leave the baby with a sitter, but will always have to miss out on adult activities, because of his over-protective co-parent. Good luck having a sex-life, since this kind of behavior usually leads to a decline in bedroom intimacy. Your friends weren't concerned with you not being able to make the ceremony, because they knew that if you were selfish enough to try to bring a baby to a wedding, you would be selfish enough to let the baby interrupt their day. Do you take your infant to the movies too? Smh, i'm speechless

Anonymous said...

No, your brother is not to blame for you decision to leave your husband behind. There are a bunch of sitter arrangements you could've made, but instead you chose to retaliate with the hostel check-mate of leaving your husband behind, and trying to make your brother feel responsible for that decision. I would have just uninvited you, if I was your brother!

Anonymous said...

Nobody is judging you, they are judging what they want to have happen on their wedding day. You cannot guarantee your kid will behave during the ceremony, and taking the kid outside during the ceremony would make your attendance pointless, as you could've just stay at home if you're going to miss part of the celebration.

Groovy Grannie said...

After reading the blogs I fully understand both sides. Our son is getting married and initially chose a reception without children. At first I was taken aback (still am truth be told) because his nieces were originally asked to be in the wedding. Now it seems that the marrying couple has changed their minds again and will not have the children at their wedding nor their reception. Confusion abounds as this is the fourth change of venue and dates. I'm still shaking my head but I do it in private lest family members think I've been struck with palsy.

It has turned into a very odd situation as these girls are old enough to have hurt feelings at 12, 11, 9. Still I will ask the few family members invited to understand the wishes of my son and soon-to-be DIL and attend with love in their hearts. I choose to stand with the marrying couple. I choose this because it is their wish, not because I agree with it or really even understand it. Boycotting is not the answer. I've chosen to take my granddaughters on their own "date night" the day after the wedding.

I will say this in defense of parents with young children...there is a period of time in a mother's life when the thought of leaving her baby (breastfed or bottle fed) is really something that is inconceivable to her. The mother/child bond is very strong and it's difficult to enjoy a celebration of coming together as a family when part of that family of friends is absent. I get it.

Times have changed and we must change with them. Another daughter has told me that her Dad and I are pretty "dialed in" compared to a lot of parents out there. She doesn't understand the "no children" thing either but says with love, "Well it's their day so they can do as they choose." She's absolutely right.

I hope I am "dialed in" because family if everything to me and I plan on seeing all of mine regularly for the rest of my days.

Anonymous said...

Are we all forgetting that after maternity leave runs out many parents go back to work, which would mean leaving a child in day care for sometimes 8 hours a day with a 'stranger' initially. My mom has daycare in her home and some kids start as early as 6 months. When children have separation anxiety issues its usually because the parents have not done a good enough job detaching the child from their hip. I understand some of the trickier issues such as when a mother is breastfeeding and it will always be their option to attend or not attend, find a babysitter or someone local where she would be able to leave the reception and go up to the hotel room to feed, there are always options. But thinking that the bride and groom are some how being insensitive because they choose a child free wedding is ridiculous.

cmc said...

We had to travel 7 hours to my brother in laws no child wedding. HOW RUDE...no, it's not! I totally understand! It posed a challenge but we kept our mouths shut and solved the problem. We brought my mother with us to watch our infant and toddler. There are options people. And if you don't have one, respectfully decline. Chances are they are expecting you not to come because of that anyway. We are having our wedding this summer and it will be child free (except those in it, our children) and my brother in law is now mad that they can't bring their 8 month old...explain that one!!!

Mom of groom said...

Anyone that indeed thinks their wishes need to be included over the Bride and Groom are selfish, period. God forbid we honor someone other then our own self wishes. These type of people that wish to feel entitlement over the host wishes are RUDE! And should stay home and stay in their own box. Sheltered and stupid.